Canada to order military plane fleet from Sweden in shift from US suppliers

104 points
1/21/1970
3 hours ago
by tosh

Comments


khriss

I can understand why this change happened. Even if American equipment is superior, there is a lot of value to not depending on a supposed 'ally' which

* Arbitrarily slapped high tariffs on all goods from Canada while exempting Russia and Belarus.

* Threatened to take over the country by force.

* Officially suspended the Permanent Joint Board on Defense between US and Canada because of criticism of US foreign policy by the Canadian PM

7 minutes ago

866-RON-0-FEZ

We call this confirmation bias.

The Saab is likely cheaper to operate as it's a smaller plane and Canada only has to patrol its northern border.

4 minutes ago

hnburnsy

Boeing and Airbus have tremendous backlogs...

>As of March 31st, 2026, Airbus reported a commercial aircraft backlog of 9,031 aircraft. Based on the company’s 2026 delivery target of 870 aircraft, this represents approximately 10.4 years of production coverage.

>Boeing’s commercial backlog stood at approximately 6,719 aircraft at the end of March. Using Forecast International’s production estimates, Boeing’s backlog equates to roughly 10.1 years of production coverage.

https://flightplan.forecastinternational.com/2026/04/14/airb...

21 minutes ago

expedition32

Also for Canada ordering from America is like France ordering tanks from Germany in 1936.

5 minutes ago

xattt

It helps that the base plane is built in Canada, and that the PM made commitments to the Swedish king in November 2025.

an hour ago

kspacewalk2

Worth noting that the base plane for one of the US-based contenders, the Aeris X by L3Harris, would also be the same Bombardier Global 6500 business jet.

21 minutes ago

866-RON-0-FEZ

Or, consider that the smaller Saab better fits the mission profile for Canada, and may be cheaper to operate, all the while The Guardian is furiously beating off trying to turn this into a bigger story than it really is.

18 minutes ago

jerlam

The US doesn't even use the Wedgetail, and has cancelled and then un-cancelled it:

https://aerospaceglobalnews.com/news/pentagon-e-7-wedgetail-...

an hour ago

ge96

Bring back the Arrow

41 minutes ago

moltar

Now the interesting question to me is why is that a country with a tenth of population can have car, truck and military plane manufacturing yet Canada can’t, even with virtually all resources for inputs, including energy can’t.

42 minutes ago

petcat

Canada has many issues. First and foremost, their entire economy is basically 3 mineral extraction industries stacked on top of each other in a trench coat.

They are also (unfortunate?) to share a border with USA and be party to NAFTA. This makes it trivial for educated, professional Canadians to work in the US on a TN visa indefinitely. We know that the doctor and nurse brain-drain from Canada to the US has been ongoing for decades. But it's actually every industry since US firms pay 2-3x more than equivalent Canadian firms.

The reality is that Canadians get very good, tax-payer subsidized educations and then immediately go to the US to work for 10+ years and only return later when they need to start drawing on the Canadian social services for things like healthcare and family care. And Canada itself got none of the benefits of that workforce in between.

I saw a figure recently that the US issued an all-time-high 800,000 TN visas to Canadians in 2016. And then in 2023 it surged to nearly 1.3 million.

22 minutes ago

turtlesdown11

> I saw a figure recently that the US issued an all-time-high 800,000 TN visas to Canadians in 2016. And then in 2023 it surged to nearly 1.3 million.

This citation is an order of magnitude off. The US doesn't really track/release visa numbers well, what you're citing might be the number of individual entries using a TN visa - visaholders go back and forth, it's not the total number of visa holders.

DHS estimates 130k Canadian visaholders in country in 2024. https://ohss.dhs.gov/topics/immigration/nonimmigrant/populat...

>their entire economy

Resource extraction is about ~10% of GDP, compared to 3-5% in the US and 1-2% in Europe. Hardly the entire economy. It's also diversified resource extraction, it's not dependent on oil, etc. Your claim is overblown.

11 minutes ago

llm_nerd

>their entire economy is basically 3 mineral extraction industries stacked on top of each other in a trench coat

This is just laughable ignorant nonsense. There is no candy coating it, you clearly have zero idea what you're yipping about.

>And then in 2023 it surged to nearly 1.3 million.

LOL. No. Again, are you getting your facts from some far-right bullshit chamber?

Don't just repeat nonsense.

5 minutes ago

hylaride

These are extremely expensive programs that the Swedes have historically been willing to pay to maintain as much neutrality as possible in their defence procurement system. A Saab Gripen has almost the same flyway cost as an F-35 because of manufacturing scale differences (maintenance is far cheaper, though) and the Gripen is far less capable (it is one of the best western fighters if a full blown war happens and your bases are all destroyed, though). Sweden had unique defence requirements due to this that wasn't being met by others.

Sweden was forced to take their defence seriously due to their geography and political will. Canada has had an easy ride and when the going got expensive, we cancelled our domestic programs (most famously the arrow, but also a lot of other stuff).

21 minutes ago

toxik

Sweden does not have a car industry. The fighter jets are a different matter, very strong technical moat and need to prove the system in combat. You can't just start a fighter jet business.

40 minutes ago

Danox

Sweden had a native car industry they decommissioned themselves, in short, they basically gave up, but they’re not alone Australia, New Zealand did the same and so did Canada, but they’re starting to realize that they were a little bit hasty in giving up….

Then last, but not least the UK basically threw the towel in too on a wide assortment of industries, but they’re now discovering that that was a big mistake.

16 minutes ago

michaelscott

It does with Volvo, although I couldn't say how big it is relative to global industry. Within Europe it's a large player

38 minutes ago

distances

Scania is Swedish, too.

35 minutes ago

sedatk

A Chinese company owns Volvo since 2010 or so.

30 minutes ago

turtlesdown11

The car part of Volvo is owned by Geely, Volvo AB makes trucks, buses, etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo

4 minutes ago

OakNinja

Volvo still produces cars in Sweden. Koenigsegg still build their cars in Ängelholm.

36 minutes ago

tredre3

But by that metric Canada also has a car industry? Canada builds 1.5M cars annually.

21 minutes ago

gmueckl

Why are you discounting Volvo?

36 minutes ago

andrewstuart

>> Sweden does not have a car industry.

Apart from Volvo, Koenigsegg and Polestar and Scania. Apart from that, you’re right.

35 minutes ago

ChrisGreenHeur

If Saab wanted to they could spin up a car factory as well. But they are more interested in selling these airplanes the article is about.

30 minutes ago

tredre3

Not that it invalidate your point, but Sweden has 1/4 the population of Canada, not 1/10.

23 minutes ago

soupbowl

Because Canada has been poorly managed for a long time by all political parties that have been voted in.

33 minutes ago

bawolff

There are trade offs in all things. Trying to do everything yourself does also have a cost. It is not neccesarily better.

27 minutes ago

llm_nerd

We have a larger partner speaking the same language and with a largely synonymous culture and a heavily integrated economy as our neighbour. The moment a Canadian company sees success -- in optics, autos, science, medicine, weaponry, etc. -- it is absorbed by a larger US company and suddenly is no longer Canadian, and in many cases any Canadian operations will usually get choked out.

There are few examples where this isn't the outcome.

This has happened across Canada for well over a century, across every sphere. And in the process the Canadian input is retconned out of existence and Americans ponder why Canada "doesn't make anything".

Sweden had nothing like this, and they punch way above their weight class because of this. Though that has been changing, for instance with a Chinese company buying Volvo, etc.

The only protection against this is...protectionism, whether explicit controls or implicitly by ownership or funding structures. Canada became a leader in nuclear tech by the nuclear industry basically being government owned. It became a transportation powerhouse by a government owned railway. And so on.

Change is afoot. Carney has made significant efforts to stop just sending hundreds of billions to the US and most military procurement will focus on Canadian products and innovation. Which leads to lots of gnashing and screaming by propaganda rags like the US-owned PostMedia.

7 minutes ago

energy123

Resources curse

28 minutes ago

jmclnx

> as the country seeks to reduce reliance on US defense firms

I wonder why ? I think we may be seeing a lot more of this.

Maybe we will get to see what US Corporations value more, real paying customers or large tax cuts w/stock buy back curtsy of US Gov Monetary Support.

32 minutes ago

bigyabai

Saab makes excellent AWACS systems, this strikes me as a good choice. It'll be interesting to see if Canada also invests in the Gripen long-term, as a replacement for the aging CF-18 fleet.

an hour ago